Leverage Curiosity for Innovative Problem-Solving in Business

Ali Taylor 0:01
Hello, hello, welcome to the next episode of the Wednesday wisdom Live series. I am Ali Taylor, CEO and founder of wisdom and Wayfinder consulting. And today I have with me Kimberly Juergen. She is going to be talking to us about curiosity. And the reason why we're doing this is the Wednesday wisdom series is where experienced professionals share their wisdom on running, growing and scaling a business. Because unless you've discovered the secret to everlasting life, you're not going to live long enough to figure all those things out by yourself. And so let me just introduce her here. Kimberly Juergen is an American actor of stage and screen known for playing caring and sympathetic characters utilizing her dry sense of humor and talent. She was also described as a science nerd and graduate of Emory University. Additionally, she is an award winning screenwriter specializing in family features and series with heart and humor. She has appeared on shows like modern family, and his made her debut at the Geffen Playhouse. Furthermore, she is a member of the WTF of Los Angeles and a SAG AFTRA member as well. Kimberly, thank you so much for being here today.

Kimberly Jürgen 1:12
Thank you. I'm so excited to chat with you today.

Ali Taylor 1:16
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So just for those, just introduce yourself a little bit like, how did you get into the things that you're doing, and share a little bit about what you're going to talk to us about today?

Kimberly Jürgen 1:30
Sure, Ah, wow, so much. So many different directions there. I love it. I started working as a professional actor. When I was still in college. I went to Emory University, originally planning on being pre med. But I ended up majoring in life, which was actually the advice that I had been given back in high school by an acting coach. And I started out as a biology major, and then I switched to physics, and then computer science and classical studies computer. And then finally got my degree in theater studies and film. So I was studying, like the past, the present the just the going inside, internally, intellectually, like the whole gambit. And so that's what I do now is, I am all about exploring and discovering. And so that's what we do as actors is creating and breathing life into a character on the page, taking the pieces of information that we were given. And then you just have to get so curious about it to expand and turn that into a full living, breathing human.

Ali Taylor 2:50
Yeah, that's incredible. Going from these very hard sciences, right, the biology and computer science and physics and all of that, to then studying, you know, just life as an actor, and the character studies and all the things that you do there. And it's interesting. So your topic today is going to be about leveraging curiosity to solve business problems. But even with all of those, it might seem like a couple of different paths, like I'm like a pretty big divergence from where you started. But science scientists are naturally curious people, computer sciences, all those different hard sciences. And then the actors that I've known and spoken to are very curious about people and their motivation. So I noticed that that through line, that thread that goes through all those things.

Kimberly Jürgen 3:37
Exactly. And my curiosity, I think, actually started when I was like, in middle, I mean, it probably was there. Because for most of us, you know, as toddlers, we're asking like, hundreds of questions a day. Yeah.

Ali Taylor 3:47
Why? Why?

Kimberly Jürgen 3:51
Because we just want to understand the world around us. Yeah. But by the time we get to, like 10, or 11, that has really dropped off, typically, because at some point, and adult just got so frustrated with all the questions that they said, Stop asking questions. And so then that imprints in our brains. I shouldn't be asking questions. And so we slowly start asking fewer and fewer questions. Yeah. To the point where when we get to about the age of 25, only about 2% of us are able to think outside the box.

Ali Taylor 4:24
That is a very sobering statistic.

Kimberly Jürgen 4:29
Yes, it is

Ali Taylor 4:31
actually pretty scary. Yeah, exactly.

Kimberly Jürgen 4:33
And that's because I think we have to simplify life to make things go faster. We diminished our curiosity. So that muscle just atrophies because we start making assumptions. Because when you stop asking questions, your brain has to close that loop somehow because your brain is still going to have those I don't know. And it's going to fill in that answer. or with an assumption? Yeah,

Ali Taylor 5:02
yeah, that reminds me of something I said to a friend a while back. She was going through like a difficult, you know, time with someone and they weren't getting a lot of information from this person. So I was like, Yeah, you know, in the absence of information, all you have is speculation. And it's such a dangerous place to be in when you all when all you have is speculation and assumption and not being able to have a pathway to look forward or look through that. Exactly,

Kimberly Jürgen 5:31
exactly. And that's what we do as actors. If I don't understand that character's world, and what causes them to do the things that they do, then I'm just gonna be me in that world. Yeah. And so you have to break down assumptions, you have to break down your projection of purpose, so that you can play that character the way they are meant to be played, so that it's not just always me on stage, or me in the movie. Yeah.

Ali Taylor 6:03
Especially if you're trying to live out or play that director's vision.

Kimberly Jürgen 6:08
Exactly, exactly. Now, of course, there are actors who are incredibly successful, and they play themselves every single time. And I enjoy watching those people too. Like there is something that's very interesting about them, but they are always bringing them to the role. So when that role comes up, the filmmakers and the casting directors know exactly who they're going to call because, oh, this is a so and so.

Ali Taylor 6:39
Yeah, this is a role for Denzel Washington. Like I'm, I'm watching Denzel Washington's interpretation of this character, or like a Cillian. Murphy, who can sort of blend into those different characters as opposed to someone like, like, no shade to the rock, but the rock is the rock wherever he goes, like,

Kimberly Jürgen 6:57
exactly, yeah. And a lot of those action heroes are like that. Yeah. Stay them. Like, he is always like, I don't care if it's, you know, how do I open this jar of pickles? He is all in on,

Ali Taylor 7:11
like, a roundhouse that.

Kimberly Jürgen 7:16
He brings that same energy. And that's what makes him so good at the Comedy too. When he's doing comedy action,

Ali Taylor 7:23
very true. Yeah. Cuz, like just thinking about some of his past roles going from the transporter, and the latest one is like the beekeeper. And then you had the shark movie. And it's like, it's just Jason Statham being Jason Statham, in all these different scenarios, and I will watch it.

Kimberly Jürgen 7:39
Yes, exactly. Shame. I will watch it. Yes. So you have those. And again, you can be very successful with that. Yeah. But then there are the actors who like Denzel Washington, Meryl Streep, Daniel Day Lewis, who really do separate themselves from the character. And they tried to start from such a blank canvas. Yeah. So that all the paint that goes on that Canvas is pure character, and nothing of the actor showing up.

Ali Taylor 8:08
Yeah, that's, and that's such an incredible skill. And I think it requires such a deep awareness of who you are. So that, you know, like, what pieces to put aside when you're showing love to do that to be into that character. Yes, exactly. Yeah. So so let's talk about like, how does this apply for businesses, especially for business owners who have a particular problem to try to solve? And maybe even for those employees who might be stepping into different roles,

Kimberly Jürgen 8:40
it all comes down to that same kind of curiosity, letting go of assumptions. Yeah. And just diving in and seeing every experience with fresh eyes. Entering it with wonder, and that leaves you open to hearing the other person's viewpoint without projecting what their opinions are, like. So often, when there's like a conflict between people in a in a in a verbal conflict between people, it's because assumptions are being made on both sides of what the other person is thinking, what their motivation is that that we haven't heard what's true for that person. And the only way we're really going to get to what is their truth? What is what's the real thing that they're concerned about? Rather than just you want my job? No, it's not that they're after your job. Maybe? Actually, it could be. But odds are, there's a whole world of stuff that has nothing to do with you. It's like when we're driving down the road, and then a car cuts us off. Yeah, if your knee jerk reaction is oh, you jerk. Why would you do that? Right, and they probably didn't even notice you.

Ali Taylor 10:01
Yeah, they're just focused on, you know, whatever is in front of them, or, you know, maybe they got a text or phone call, something that, like really important that just came in and took their eyes off for a second. And unfortunately, it impacted you in a negative way. Right.

Kimberly Jürgen 10:17
But we take things personally, because we assume that it had to do with us. Yeah, that somebody is attacking us that somebody is anti us in some way? Yeah. Well, most of the time, that's not the case. Sometimes it is. Yeah. Like, because, again, I don't think there's any blanket statements. But you have to be open to the possibility that there are multiple possibilities.

Ali Taylor 10:48
And I, but I find that a lot of people and aren't aren't able to do that aren't able to hold, you know, especially two conflicting ideas or thoughts at the same time without being consumed by one or both of them.

Kimberly Jürgen 11:03
Correct. And that's where developing that sense of curiosity that really is like, I can call myself a radical curiosity coach. And so it, it has to be radical curiosity, because this is one of the things I love when somebody starts a statement with, I'm just curious, and then they say the thing that always like intrigues me, and I'm like, let's see if you really are curious, right? Because there's a difference between asking a question and being curious. Yeah,

Ali Taylor 11:32
yeah. If there's a very passive aggressive tone that can come with, well, I'm just curious. And then they say they're out there assumption is, but really, what they're curious is if their assumption is correct or not, right?

Kimberly Jürgen 11:46
They're looking for a specific reaction from you, or a specific thing from you, rather than truly being open to what's happening.

Ali Taylor 11:59
Yeah, yeah. And what's happening with the other person, and especially with, you know, if you're, I mean, I had this experience with, with a job that I was at, where there was a lot of sort of different paths and sort of insecurities and inner chaos. That was that we're talking to each other versus us really communicating with each other. Right now that I've had a lot of years of perspective and distance from that moment, being able to have a better idea of what was really happening. And I could just see it's sort of those inner children, those inner conflicts coming together. What the hell is that? Thumbs up? Cool. You

Kimberly Jürgen 12:44
are here working on a Mac? Because that's what happens on a Mac.

Ali Taylor 12:48
I've ever seen that before. Hey, all right. We got fireworks today.

Kimberly Jürgen 12:56
We can also get confetti. Nice.

Ali Taylor 12:58
Oh, that's cool.

Kimberly Jürgen 13:02
Yes. And if you're a rock star,

Ali Taylor 13:06
nice. Alright, here. Yes, that

Kimberly Jürgen 13:09
is the latest update this Anoma update on a Mac. Okay. All of these interesting little automations.

Ali Taylor 13:18
So you have to be careful, do my updates at some point?

Kimberly Jürgen 13:22
Oh, my gosh, when I when I'm teaching, and I'm like we're really into a thing. And then all of a sudden, the fireworks go off? Or I'm like, Oh, seriously?

Ali Taylor 13:33
Well, I'm glad it wasn't distracting, serious point during that. But yeah, just just back to that, yeah, you can see a lot of times, especially in news organization, where there's a lot of egos that are at play, there's a lot of like insecurity that's at play. And there's a lot of bringing yourself to the sort of unresolved unhealed self to the situation or the problem or to the workplace. And then the mission, the vision is ignored in favor of these little, you know, these little ego trips, these little ego tips, which I'm sure I'm going to assume that that's something that you've dealt with on different sets in cast that you've been on. Exactly,

Kimberly Jürgen 14:19
exactly. And in because I also coach, folks in business, I coach entrepreneurs as well. And so when we're working on those things, it's usually the need is to always step back, because it's the idea of you can't see the forest for the trees, because you're so deep inside the forest. Yeah, you can't see that bird's eye view anymore. But curiosity, it helps you to step back so that you can see a wider view, but it also diminishes your emotional attachment to the moment which is where most of that stuff is coming from. Um, it's all like fueled by, you know, whatever emotionally is happening for you. You're feeling vulnerable in some way. And so if you are someone who responds to that feeling with pushback and aggression, yeah, then that's what you're gonna bring to that moment, unless you're able to step back and go. What's going on here? What's happening? Yeah, so your system just got triggered? Yeah,

Ali Taylor 15:28
it's got hijacked, right? Yes. Yeah. So how do you how do you deal with that? Both on a film set, but then also in coaching your entrepreneurial clients to manage that in the moment?

Kimberly Jürgen 15:43
Well, fortunately, I am neuro spicy. Which means that my brain is wired a little bit differently. In my case, I am also dyslexic. So I really like my brain is wired in a way that I see things in completely different ways. Yeah. Like the Dead Poets Society, when he stands up on the desk. I'm like, yeah, man, give me that desk. Like, I always like standing on 1000 Different desks when I'm looking at something. Yeah. And that's just what my brain automatically does. But I give my conscious brain like permission to be aware of all of that, because it's going to be happening in the background anyway. But I'm like, How can I make the most of this? How can I use this as a superpower? Rather than something that just distracts me? And I can't make a decision? But how can I look at it and go, Oh, look at all these options I have to play with.

Ali Taylor 16:41
Interesting. So rather than viewing it as like, Man, I'm not coming across, you know, in a sort of neurotypical way, or what are you know, my brain and my emotions, my nervous system is being hijacked? How can I use this as leverage to accomplish something that I that I want to do? Is that Is that what you're saying?

Kimberly Jürgen 17:03
Exactly. So how can I solve the problem? So everybody's brain is the way their brain is? I? I'm actually not a fan of thinking of anything as neurotypical because I'm like, What does that even mean? Exactly. So I'm like, this is just the way my brain is wired. And the way your brain is wired is also super awesome. And let's get in and figure out how you work and how you do what you do. And so that's what I do with each of my clients is first off, like, let's get in and let's really understand, like, what is happening for you in any given situation. So that you understand when that because, you know, the brain is just so freakin awesome. You know, it's, I love how it works. It is the most complex and beautiful machine. It's, I am so in awe of it. Like, I totally know why I started on the science track. And like that was that was my jam, or that

Ali Taylor 18:03
was like your foray into everything else. Yeah, yes. And I still

Kimberly Jürgen 18:07
I still actually get to dip my toe in it. I'm working with a company now where we are looking at genetics and how you can apply your genetic code to what you do. Interesting, because everything is on your code, like how you vote is in your DNA, how you like preferences? It's all in your DNA plus all of the other things like are you an introvert or an extrovert? That's DNA.

Ali Taylor 18:33
Interesting.

Kimberly Jürgen 18:36
What is your Are you more of a warrior or a warrior? There's one gene that that can identify which of those is your reaction to how you confront stressful situations?

Ali Taylor 18:51
Yeah, I know, I forgot who, who I was talking to about this. But we were talking about like voters and certain voters tend to have a larger amygdala. So their sensitivity to danger and threats is a bit higher than those who don't. And so that he, I think the study said that that kind of aligns with like how certain people vote, or at least the messages that they respond to when it comes to voting.

Kimberly Jürgen 19:20
Yeah. But even like, other preferences, like it's so incredible how we thought we were so much more in control of things. Yeah. So that so it really is a true balance of nature and nurture. So I just I could geek out on that all day, too. But but let's stick with what I have to keep reading my brain back end to see exactly how this can be applied for folks with their business. Yeah, well, you're doing a great job keeping me on that track, by the way. Yeah,

Ali Taylor 19:59
well, my I'm just singing, like all the different things. And so it's it's, you know, if you're, if your premise is that, you know, all those things are tied back to genetics in some way, then there is, in our you're also saying that like the jobs that you're picking maybe the roles that you're picking the type of industry that you're in, is also a function or at least influenced by the genetic makeup or disposition of your brain. Is that Is that what you're saying?

Kimberly Jürgen 20:28
Well, because nurture plays such a large role in it, too. It's not just one or the other, it really is both, right? It truly is both. So for example, you might have the gene for perfect pitch. But if you are not exposed to music at a certain time, during your formative early years, that genes never really going to come into play. Right?

Ali Taylor 20:54
So it's like if Charlie Puth, you know, never got exposed to music never had that opportunity to even discover that he had that. We might not even know who he is, right?

Kimberly Jürgen 21:06
Or who knows what would have happened. But but it's all about, it's all about all of it. And people who are may have the gene for for being very shy, because there's a shyness gene to. So you may be genetically predisposed to be shy. But if you are raised in a family and in a community that encourages you to step into the spotlight, and to you know, take your space and to share your voice. Yeah, that can that becomes your dominance.

Ali Taylor 21:39
Yeah, yeah, I think I definitely see that and agree with that. It's a lot. Like you can have the possibility for all those things, genetic wise, but if your environment doesn't support the growth of that, or the expression of that gene, that is where you know, things tend to go south, in my opinion,

Kimberly Jürgen 21:59
right? Yeah. Right. But then you may find like, in an unexpected circumstance, then suddenly you're shy. And you're like, why am I shy? Yeah, it might be because it's in your genetic code. Or it could be, you know, a million other reasons. And that's where Curiosity can really help you tap into that. Of what is it that has brought me to this moment? And what can I do about it?

Ali Taylor 22:25
Yeah, so not just curiosity about the world around you, but also curiosity within yourself?

Kimberly Jürgen 22:29
Exactly. Yeah, that's actually where I start folks, coaching is getting curious about themselves. Because if you if you can get that that gets the ball rolling. Because if you're not curious about yourself first, then it's like building a house but forgetting a foundation. Yeah. Yeah. A lot. I don't want to live in that house. Yeah. So if you are building your business, but you haven't done some some self inspection, yeah, then you are going to have like some shaky walls and all kinds of stuff is going to happen, because you haven't built yourself to support that house that you are building.

Ali Taylor 23:16
Yeah, 100%. And going back to this statistic that you said, at the top of the call, where it's like 2% of the population by the age of 25, doesn't have the ability to think outside of the box. It just makes me wonder, you know, what's really happening on society where people are just sort of, I guess, trapped in, you know, whatever, programming, whatever. I like to say whatever script is sort of being pushed out by society at that time, like, they don't realize, like when Shakespeare said that all the world's a stage and they don't realize that there are players in this in this stage. And they never stopped to question, well, is this really what I want? Or am I just following the script that's been laid out and put before me? Right?

Kimberly Jürgen 23:58
And I would, I would just tweak your language just a little bit and saying, it's not that they don't have the ability. It's that they forgotten how to think outside the box?

Ali Taylor 24:07
Forgotten? Yeah, yeah, you're

Kimberly Jürgen 24:11
gonna be reminded you how to do it. So they haven't lost anything. They've just misplaced it.

Ali Taylor 24:16
Yeah, it's been covered up, you know, sort of buried by all of the societal expectations and everything. That's yeah, exactly.

Kimberly Jürgen 24:25
And part of is because the world moves so fast now that we feel like we have to move to catch up. And curiosity can feel like it is slowing you down. But it's one of those counterintuitive, because you actually move faster when you slow down. When you're slowing down to get curious. Yeah,

Ali Taylor 24:45
it's like sharpening the axe as opposed to just swinging harder and faster. Exactly.

Kimberly Jürgen 24:49
Exactly. An awesome analogy. I love that.

Ali Taylor 24:54
Thank you. Appreciate that. Um, yeah, it's one of the things that I've I I do a lot of stuff of development, like, you know, personally, personally and professionally. And one of the things that I've discovered along this whole, like, healing and you know, improvement journey is that a lot of the work that we're doing is just unlearning all of the crap of EPA has been put on top of who I already was, like five year old me had everything locked down. He knew exactly why he was here, what he was doing, like how the world works. And then you just learn all this things like on top of it, and it's just, yeah, and so now it's like the proper process of undoing and unlearning all of that.

Kimberly Jürgen 25:35
Exactly. Because we learn other people's crap. Yeah, yeah. So there's so much that we have like, the shame and the blame, all of that is like adopted from other people. And those are the things that we have to unlearn. And like, you know what, that shame is not mine that belongs to this person from my childhood. And I co opted it. And maybe it served me. But you know what I'm given that I'm returning that Return to Sender.

Ali Taylor 26:10
Yeah, oh, that's funny. It just reminds me of a conversation. I was on a date a couple of weeks ago, and the lady was saying how she was traveling in like her mom's like old hometown, overseas. And she's like, carrying a backpack with all of her mom's like stuff in it. So she's literally standing on her mom's childhood Street, like, where she grew up, carrying her mother's things she, like, had cried out, it's like, this stuff isn't even mine. And it's like, oh

yes, such an awesome moment when she said that.

Kimberly Jürgen 26:51
Brilliant. Yeah,

Ali Taylor 26:52
but it's funny. That's what we carry into so many different areas of our life. And, you know, I think about those stories of actors and actresses who had such a hard time, sort of separating themselves from a role that they really dove into like Heath Ledger being one of the prime examples of that, and just the damage that that does. And so, you know, I think about a lot of businesses today, and I think I even talked about this on one of the Wealth Summit, which was, you know, you go into business, and you start it with this whole attitude of maybe trying to prove yourself, because you grew up in an environment where you weren't supported, you weren't really nurtured in so everything is all about trying to prove your worth. And that's a terrible foundation on which to build a business on which to build a life in which to operate inside of a job. And so, you know, as a radical curiosity, Coach, what are some of the things that people are saying to you? What are some of the problems that you've identified that they kind of have in common when they come to work with you?

Kimberly Jürgen 28:00
Wow, there are, because people tend to come to me from different things like somebody might be struggling with sales. So they come to me, and what we discover is that they're challenged with sales, there's so many things that could possibly be the roadblock for them from doing that. Some people come to me when they are struggling with networking. So as an introvert myself, it can be exhausting to go to networking events. And so how do you create strategies and structures for that, so that you can move your business forward doing something that typically is associated with such like negative and on? Yeah. And like, at the end of the day, I'm going to feel this God, I don't want to do that. Because I don't want to feel that at the end of the day. So how do we how do we reshift that? How do we re label things? That's a big part of the work that I do with folks. But typically, when they come to me, it's just because it's not working. And they've tried a bunch of stuff, and they don't know how to do it. And I'm like, alright, well, then let's figure it out. Because a lot of times folks have heard from a guru that this is how you do it. Yeah. And so people will think, okay, then it worked for them. It'll work for me. But hey, remember, neuro spicy. One of the things I learned early on is that their process is not necessarily my process. And what worked for them is amazing, and I think it's fabulous. But to think that that works for everybody. We're not all the same people.

Ali Taylor 29:49
No, not at all. Similar unless I'm, unless

Kimberly Jürgen 29:53
I'm a carbon copy of them. It's just not going to be it's it's not going to be necessarily the thing so so Sometimes it's just tweaking it. So how do we take this idea and just sometimes it's just like a minor, like when you go to the to your take your car in to get some work done, and they're like, they just tighten a bolt, and that fixed it, no, like, oh man, and sometimes transmission has to get. So that's how I look at it. Sometimes we can like fix something with just like a tiny little, let's just tighten that bolt and boom, you're off to the races. Yeah, sometimes we may need to go in and do like a complete engine overhaul to get it done, but the only way you're going to discover that is by going in with curiosity. I don't go in with any feeling that I know what the problem is, or know what the solution is. Because I don't know their world. Yeah. And everything matters. That's where we were talking about the Gen X. It's both nature and nurture. Nothing exists in a vacuum. So is the problem that the foundation needs a little bit more support? Or is the foundation solid, but then there's something that's like in the wiring or in the walls? Or in the store? Like, where? Where is the thing that's causing the House of Cards?

Ali Taylor 31:14
Yeah, yeah. And I can imagine, so like that, I, I love all of that. I'm one of my favorite characteristics, and another human being is their curiosity. I love people who are naturally curious that way. And I think that's been the secret to my success is the level of curiosity that I have. I mean, you see all the books that have behind me all the different jobs that I've worked all the different conversations that I had. But for someone who is a stressed and overworked business owner, who's trying to figure out how to how am I going to get, you know, sales into the door next week? Otherwise, I gotta start laying some people off, I have to start having some conversations about maybe moving my office like downsizing in some way. What some, like, what can you say to someone like that, who may not think that they have time for curiosity?

Kimberly Jürgen 32:08
Take a step back. Stand on that desk, we'll go back to the Dead Poets Society, step on that desk and look at it from a different angle. Because, yeah, when you are so inside a problem, you can't see a way out. Yeah. And sometimes just that change of perspective, just and it doesn't even have to be like a major overhaul. Sometimes it's just taking a step back, taking a deep breath. Anybody who feels like they can't solve the problem should probably start with their breathing. Hmm. Because odds are, there is something that like, tension is going to stop your breathing. And when your nervous system gets into that, fight flight or freeze mode, you cannot solve problems. So I have about like 20, different, like nervous system, regulation, things that I share with the folks that I work with. But one really simple one that you can do at any time, is just turn your head to the side. And then look at everything that's around there. And then turn your head to the other side and look at everything that's around there. And if you've got like neck issues, just like a little bit, that's all you need is just a little bit of a turn. Because genetically, like biologically, when we are in fight flight, or freeze mode, we can't turn away, because we are fixated on whatever it is that it that we feel is attacking us. Oh, so if you just turn your head and take in everything, it tells your nervous system, it's all fun. It's all good. So now you can come back and it will immediately for most people. Now again, we're all you know the way that we are? Yeah. So some people may need a little bit more than that. But for a lot of folks that can instantly just you're going to notice like a relaxation. Oh, okay. And that can be enough for you to see it with a little bit of distance.

Ali Taylor 34:18
Yeah, I love that. I remember. I think it was Suzanne who said that like breathing changes to story. So take that time to do the breath work to and then adding in the looking at, you know, changing you're turning your head, right literally physically looking at things differently, and then standing on your desk. So give yourself I mean, make sure your desk is strong enough and supportive to be able to do that. But you can actually stand on a desk, you know that right? Does switch things up?

Kimberly Jürgen 34:53
Yes. Or your chair. If it's not if it's not a swivel chair, then maybe you could just like stand on your chair like Anything that's going to shift your perspective? For me, that also makes it fun. Yeah. And when you can approach things with nuts, I think why curiosity just jazzes me so much. Because it's fun because it's new and it's unexpected. And it gives me like new things to play with.

Ali Taylor 35:20
Yeah, well just shocks the brain, right? Yes.

Kimberly Jürgen 35:23
And so if you can do that, with whatever it is that stressing you out, just like maybe even like, just change the angle that you're looking at it? Or like, do something so that you're looking at it in some way. That is different. Yeah. What if you feel like I can't do this? I can't do this. Just a simple, but what if I could?

Ali Taylor 35:46
That's a great one. I love that. But what if I could?

Kimberly Jürgen 35:50
Yeah, so there's a simple question that you can ask yourself anytime you feel, Oh, this just isn't working. But what if it was? Oh, okay. And like, suddenly, just when I say that to myself right now, like, I feel a change in me. Because I have opened myself to the possibility of something other than problem.

Ali Taylor 36:12
Yeah. And your brain has to, like, have to deal with that question. Because it always wants to close that loop. And so I remember one of the coaches that I was working with, you know, we were talking about, like, different affirmations and stuff that you could try. And, you know, it was like, Well, I don't necessarily believe that. So she's like, well, if you're having trouble believing that, then ask yourself, well, what if I did? You know, what if I am, you know, so and so are XY and Z? Well, now your brain actually has to stop and wrestle with that question. Well, what would that actually look like? You know,

Kimberly Jürgen 36:47
what are the what are the things that I could put into place to make that true, instead of this perceived truth? Yes. Because those assumptions are where we feel like there was one truth. There was only one, there was only one way that I can experience this thing. Sales are horrible. There's only one way that I can feel about sales. There is only one way that I can respond to the numbers that I'm seeing on this page. What if there wasn't? What if you could look at those numbers? And rather than seeing them as a disaster, seeing them as a wake up call? Oh, I need to shift something. So these numbers aren't working? These aren't the numbers that I'm wanted to be seeing. I mean, we're getting into tax time now. So we're looking at their numbers. And if they're not what you want, then get curious and think. So what were the pieces that fit together to result in these numbers? And what can I do differently?

Ali Taylor 37:50
Yeah. What if like, those two words, what if can be very powerful? And you can either use them for good or you can use them to 14 yourself? Yes, yeah. Yeah. Because I mean, you know, I've talked to I talked to business owners who hate sales. And here's where I've experienced this a lot. I was talking to someone yesterday, about nonprofits, and a lot of like, nonprofit people, they hate the idea of selling, they think it's like being scammy or spammy. You know, the idea of asking for money, it's like, well, it should just be the cause, like people should just care about the cause. And if I put it off, like sad puppies and crying children in front of them, people are going to open up their wallets. And it's like, well, no, they're going to they're going to feel something. But that doesn't mean that they're going to actually give and you have to be able to ask for money. And it's like, well, what if you didn't look at sales? Look at it as being scammy. or spammy. But you looked at it as I am, I am serving, right one, I'm giving this business, this person the opportunity to give back and to do something good, right. So there's the psychological, the psychographic, good that they experienced with that. But then I'm also supporting this cause in a real and tangible way. So what if you could look at it that way?

Kimberly Jürgen 39:18
Exactly. And that's where it comes to labeling. And so a lot of my clients, that's what I work with them on, can we just change the label on this because you have this baggage attached to the idea of sales? Yeah. And what that means so your past negative experience with salespeople is what you are assuming people are thinking about you, when you come to talk to them and ask for an investment in your nonprofit, or want them to buy your widgets or whatever it is. And so again, we're going back to the assumptions. We're bringing that old stuff into this new moment. And so shifting that so that it's not that I'm trying to sell them anything. It's that I am presenting them with an option. Yeah. An opportunity I'm doing. Yeah. And if they say no to this option, that's okay. If they say yes to this option, amazing, now we have an opportunity to make some real change in your life in the world, in your business, whatever it is that we may be, you know, going into collaboration on. And that's how I look at sales is that we are looking at an opportunity to collaborate on a thing. We're gonna we're gonna go into business together on an idea.

Ali Taylor 40:36
Yeah, we're co creating this like, we're part

Kimberly Jürgen 40:39
of something. Yeah. And that feels so much more exciting to me. Yeah. straighter. Exactly. And I've been in sales, like my whole life, like from Girl Scouts. I was one of those, you know, in the parking lot. You're

Ali Taylor 41:00
one of the original cookie dealers. Yes,

Kimberly Jürgen 41:02
indeed. topsails. Nice. Yes. Yeah. Because I saw it as fun. I just again, no spicy. I took a jingle from a shoe commercial. And use that to sell cookies.

Ali Taylor 41:22
Oh, what, uh, what jingle? Was it?

Kimberly Jürgen 41:26
Two for the price of one plus $1. Okay. And that shows you how long ago it was that I was a Girl Scout because they were only $1 A box back then.

Ali Taylor 41:36
Yeah, they're definitely.

Kimberly Jürgen 41:37
Definitely not $1 anymore. Yeah. So you'd have to come up with your own jingle. But yeah, so I thought that and I'm like, oh, that could be fun here. And it would like I would sing that to somebody and they would, they would start smiling. And then they'd reach for their wallet. Yeah. And they take their cookies home. So it's all about finding the fun. And the fun can come from being curious. Because again, you're not feeling in tuned in the problem.

Ali Taylor 42:09
Yeah, that's a great word InterMed in the problem. So I feel so many people are feeling that way. Especially with all of the different search, like outside circumstances that are happening both economically just socio politically gold globally in the world, and then just whatever's gonna happen in the election season. Like there's so many different things. And of course, with inflation, like, all of these things can be problems and be able to ask that question of what if? Yeah, yeah. What if I looked at it differently? What if it wasn't as bad? You know, what if there was opportunity inside of all these different things that are happening?

Kimberly Jürgen 42:51
Yes, yeah. What if the room was bigger than this corner where the problem exists? Because we're nose is buried in that corner of the room, we can't even see what else is in our room, we can't see what we have access to. In that room. Because our nose is buried in a corner. All we see are our complete peripheral view is nothing but problem. And the further we can step back from that problem, the more we can see the rest of the room and the rest of our resources and the rest of our capacity.

Ali Taylor 43:30
Oh, I love that. That's such a that's such a good way of looking at it. Thank you. Yeah. Awesome. All right. So if somebody wants to work with you, what is the what is the thing that they should do? Where do they need to go? What do they need to do?

Kimberly Jürgen 43:50
Well, they can go to my website, Kimberly juergen.com. And there are ways that they can connect with me there. You can schedule a time to meet with me if you just want to chat about it and see what kind of impact this could make for you in your life in your business. And that's the great thing about curiosity it like you'll find like once you start getting curious, like you become infected with this bug of curiosity and suddenly like you want to spread it and you want to be curious about everything. Just the same way that that toddler was like so excited about all of their questions.

Ali Taylor 44:30
Yeah, I was gonna say you kind of become a kid again you get to go ask all those those why questions?

Kimberly Jürgen 44:36
Exactly. Oh, don't get me started on why questions will lead a whole nother chat for that. Why? Because why questions can be pointless. Hmm.

Ali Taylor 44:54
Yeah, there there is a point at which you can navel gaze too long. Um, you kind of just need to make a decision. And then you know, make the decision, right? It's for likes to say, right? So yeah. All right. And then I have your link, which I will post into the comments, once this is posted up on all the different social channels. And I always like to end these calls with having you share just one piece of wisdom that you would like to pass on, doesn't have to be related to business, just one piece of wisdom that you would like to pass on to anybody that's watching.

Kimberly Jürgen 45:36
Get curious, have fun in life. And one of the simplest things that you can do to begin to reawaken that curiosity within you, is to just ask yourself, How do I feel? And you can start with how you physically feel, because that's an easy one. For most of us, how do you physically feel? And then how do you feel about how you feel?

Ali Taylor 46:04
Oh, that's some like Inception level. Kind of questioning there.

Kimberly Jürgen 46:09
Exactly. So if you've got one of those smartwatches that, like remind you to get up and move. I know, I've been on airplanes, where suddenly somebody's watch is gonna go off, and suddenly they start pacing up and down the aisle. So if you have one of those, every time it goes off, just let your first thought be. How does my body feel right now? Yeah. And that's the first step. Because as you get more aware, because most of us, we have no idea how our body feels. We are not connected to who we are as a physical being at all. So tapping into that, and the more you do that, see, this is the good stuff. Where you get to is feeling the tension in your body. And when you can discover the tension and be aware of it every time it begins to bloom in your body. That's where it literally the sky's the limit on the possibilities for yourself and for your life. Because tension is the enemy of creativity.

Ali Taylor 47:16
Tension is the enemy of creativity. i That's a quotable. I like that. Thank you. Well, Kimberly, thank you so much for being here today. Really appreciate everything you shared. So many good nuggets that are in there. It's gonna be hard to figure out which one to post but I thank you again for just showing up sharing your wisdom and yeah, look forward to seeing everybody next week. For Wednesday, wisdom live. Take care.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai